Sometimes I feel selfish for doing my own things, but most of the time i don't. Being that my primary partner cannot plan a thing (unless i plan it, or its a vacation) makes it harder for me sometimes to be more "present".
I know "extremes" are always bad, but sometimes I feel like not planning is just straight out selfish and not being present, whatcha guys think?
Is there such a fine line between the two?
I know "extremes" are always bad, but sometimes I feel like not planning is just straight out selfish and not being present, whatcha guys think?
Is there such a fine line between the two?
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Fri, May 11, 2007 - 2:43 PMYou should see the movie "The Break Up" and determine if you really...want to push that one too far. It's a great learning movie for the whole of it, though the movie isn't a 5 star flick.
+SW->
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Fri, May 11, 2007 - 4:23 PMI don't think they are connected like that. You should never have to feel like planning things and doing them is selfish because your SO doesn't do things that way. On the other hand I don't think that them not scheduling is necessarily selfish...though I'm sure it feels that way and I think that not working on it for things that are important to you could be based in some self centeredness. -
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Sat, May 12, 2007 - 12:42 AMCompromise is necessary in any relationship that will last.
+SW->
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Sun, May 13, 2007 - 12:44 PMAre you being selfish or are you feeling guilty for doing your own things?
I am selfish (or perhaps self-centered) because I want you to stop hurting yourself. Being selfish might mean providing enough for our own needs first before committing to doing too much outside of self.
I feel guilty because perhaps I am ashamed to admit honestly what the truth is for me now.
Being present to me means being, breathing, feeling all of my feelings fully, and letting go of my stories. Here and now.
If you want Mother Earth to laugh, tell her your plans. -
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Tue, May 15, 2007 - 12:13 PMsorry, i didn't realize it was a question, i thought you were reflecting.lol.
I don't feel selfish for doing my own things, nor guilty...i love my alone time/creative time actually....I guess what i was trying to have people see was that by being fully present means only thinking of yourself, which can be very selfish at times.
and yes, me and mother earth laugh a lot together...i'm a silly girl at heart.... -
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Tue, May 15, 2007 - 6:21 PMYou are right, I am reflecting, and I wanted to check in with you. I appreciate you laughing and writing "i love my alone time/creative time actually." Being fully present means a lot by the postings written here.
I don't think of thinking as being fully present -- see, I am not fully present in writing this. I observe my thoughts, my busy ego mind, hypnotic stories, patterns of beauty and desire. I watch them and let them go.
in reflection and laughter,
mmphosis
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Sun, May 13, 2007 - 12:48 PMi'm not sure i understand the question.
to me, being present is being able to be in the here and now, to sense what is happening at this moment, without worrying about the past or the future, just being.
and selfish is only thinking of yourself.
are you saying you think your partner is being selfish because he expects you do to all the planning? or that you feel selfish if the things you plan are always the things you prefer?
i used to have a complaint about my ex-roommates not caring what the place looked like, and not doing their share of cleaning. my friend pointed out that since i was the one who cared, then i should not feel guilty about doing things the way i wanted, nor did i have a right to be critical of them just doing what they wanted, which was nothing. in other words, because it mattered to me and not to them, then it was my choice if i wanted to do it.
once that sunk in, i became a lot nicer about it all ;^) (though i still might not quite undertstand your distrinction between selfish and present here) -
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Sun, May 13, 2007 - 2:18 PMI just had a thought. I am thinking that different people need different things in order to feel present...some people seem to need to not worry about anything or think ahead, or look back at all. For me I need to have the past stuff taken care of and the future stuff on track. Then I can be present. -
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Mon, May 14, 2007 - 2:48 PMwell, yes, it is hard for many (most?) people to be present....and i feel like i CAN be present without worrying so much, but i do need to feel like i have stuff "on track" as well.....but in order for things to be "on track" that requires future thought which leads to not being present.lol. -
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Mon, May 14, 2007 - 3:08 PMI don't know really. I can only use my girlfriend and I as an example. We have an interesting relationship that after 6 years, still constantly evolves. We met while on separate vacations in the same place and spent 10 days together. After that we dated long distance for a year. During that time I flew to Milwaukee once a month and she flew to Tennessee once per month. Then when we talked about one or the other moving we decided that Milwaukee would have the best opportunities for both of us. When I first moved I was totally dependent on her circle of friends for company other than Sarah. As I have lived her I have developed my own circle of friends and now we hang out with them all seperately and on occasion at the same time. We go out with our friends separate from one another constantly, however we also spend a lot of time with one another. I like to plan things while she is more spur of the moment. So when she plans something with me, then she will ask first if I am busy. If I am not then we make the plan. Most of the time she will makes plans that do not include me and that is fine by me. We have a very loving relationship without all of the me me me nonsense that tends to clutter up what could be a good partnership. We are almost like bad weather friends. When things are going good, then we play everything by ear, but when times are tough we are always by each others side giving comfort and love.
In my opinion, many people spend too much time worrying about spending too much time with one another. Just go with the flow and enjoy your individuality while sharing your life with someone special. Otherwise it tends to turn into the old, 'your not paying enough attention to me' game that is sure to be the downfall of what could have been.
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Mon, May 14, 2007 - 2:47 PM<to me, being present is being able to be in the here and now, to sense what is happening at this moment, without worrying about the past or the future, just being. >
true, but that is also only thinking of yourself, which is perfectly fine, but can come off as being selfish when you refuse to make plans with anything to do with the future (not you specifically, just really "it")
I didn't mean to say negative things about my primary, he doesn't mind that i make plans (as long as i don't make TOO MANY.lol) but i do feel stressed sometimes making plans without his say in them. he is so centered around being present (the most extreme case i've ever seen/heard/felt) that i feel like he just doesn't care about anyone but himself, which makes it seem like he's selfish a lot of the time (and other people he has relationships with).
Yet, i think it's because his parents were so extreme (and he was an only child) and made so many decisions for himself, that he has a hard time making decisions in general.
All i'm saying is that by being TOO PRESENT can lead to being selfish and only thinking of yourself, since if you are present, you are thinking only of being present and in your head....shit am i making any sense? lol.
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Mon, May 14, 2007 - 3:10 PMlol
I think you are selfish in thinking that other people are honestly calling you "selfish" because you might be selfish in being fully present. And, I didn't recieve an answer, as yet, to my question about feeling guilt. Or, is it shame? What is stopping you from being selfish, Angel? Honestly?
(;
mmphosis
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Wed, May 16, 2007 - 5:16 PMno, being present does not necessarily mean only thinking about yourself at all.
i can be completely present to the emotions of another person. i can be entirely present to the wind and the sky, with not awareness of me as separate from that at all. i can be present when i'm making love, about how my lover is feeling.
being present is having something feel like it is existing for you... right now... right here... it is all there is, and everything else is out of mind.
maybe we're talking about different things. it sounds like he wants to be present-oriented... which is different than being present. people who are watching tv are present-oriented, but they are not present, for instance. just because you're not thinking abou tht efuture or the past doesnt' mean you're truly expeirenceing the present.
and... semantics or not, i get that your real concern is that your guy prefers to go with the flow rather than make and respect plans, so you end up having to plan for both of you, and not knowing if he's going to want to do that when the time comes, or you make plans for yourself, and feel a little guilty about that.
i'd be frustrated too. i have had a relationship in my life recently with someone who seems pretty unable to do anything at a specific time, because there is no way to forecast his state of mind. other than getting on a plane at a designated time, he rarely does anything at a promised time, and any plans he makes are pretty much just a flimsy notion, and rarely come into existence.
personally, i think that when you live life totally in the flow, with no feeling that you have a choice and can set a course for what you want to do, you give up a lot of power. i'm not interested in that.
though we're all different. for instance, i leave monday for a month in thailand. thanks to the internet, i can make all of my plans in advance... and i have. i have hotels booked, flights booked, appointments of all sorts made, people contacted... i have a plan. and for me, that works very well, because as a solo traveler, it takes a lot of stress away from each day to now where i'm supposed to be.
of course, i know whre i'm going and what i really want to do there. but having my plans made has made me so much more peaceful than previous trips where i just arrived and had to walk around looking for where i wanted to stay, or decide when i wanted to go from one place to the next. i like it that way. other people may not.
it really sounds to me like he may have a confidence issue about making choices. and choosing to do nothing is a choice of its own, but you sure can't get much accomplished that way. and the kinds of things most of us like to do require at least a lttle planning... concert tickets, arrangements with friends, clases to take, it is a balance of thinking about what you want in your future, and taking the steps to have it there when you arrive. -
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Wed, May 16, 2007 - 5:18 PMapologies for the typos -- i type superfast and don't have time to proof. hope it makes sense ;^)
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Sun, May 20, 2007 - 3:49 PMinstead of trying to make it be about something in his past, perhaps you might adopt the idea that this is what your primary wants in life, and perhaps what you're feeling is a little bit of resentment that you are less important to him than being present is. what do you hope to gain by trying to draw him into some imaginary future? in what way is making plans about the future a smarter move than adopting awareness and simply adapting to the needs of the moment? he adapts to your needs in the moment by not inhibiting your need to make plans, but it seems as if you're not adapting to the moment by allowing him and yourself to participate fully in it. the moment is an "it" of sorts. the future is not. the future is maya. -
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Tue, May 29, 2007 - 12:53 PMbeleive me, i am adapting! LOL....the one thing i'm good at is CHANGE..:) thanks for your thoughts guys!
leslie, as always, you put it so eloquently....thank you so much :)
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Wed, May 30, 2007 - 3:33 PMEvery person enjoys doing something that other partner doesn't, and likewise, every partner has strengths such as planning or execution that the other does not--necessitating delegation of tasks. This is not something to feel guilty about, it's just the way human beings are made.
The important thing to remember is that in a relationship we complement others by our very presence, just as our partners add something that we don't have. I often like to think of human beings as being individual jigsaw pieces--together we make a greater whole. However, that doesn't mean that we have to be present at all times; an individual has their own needs, and a respectful partner will recognize that.
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Re: fine line between being SELFISH or being PRESENT.
Sat, July 28, 2007 - 1:44 PMThats a totally awesome question.
I think it all revolves around the idea of where one person ends and the other begins.
Its hard for me to get into my husbands 'things' too. I quit my school and job to work at his business. And after a year, it still feels like his baby-not mine.
Giving your energy can be a more passive thing. And thats okay too.